Need 2 different Instances of a song...

edited 11:54PM in Development

I know we can edit a song in the service order, and have it not affect the master song, at least I think that's right isn't it?   Anyway, Sometimes, when we introduce a new song, the worship pastor wants to just do the chorus, and then later in the service, we'll do the whole song.  I tried putting the song in 2x and then just changing the verse order to only have the Chorus, but it seemed to change both instances in the service.  Is it not possible to do this?  If it is, what am I missing, if it's not currently, could it be :)


  • edited March 2012

    Check your settings, you may need to enable that.

  • edited March 2012

    I have needed two different versions of the same song and simply saved one with a sightly different title (file name).  This works for me.

  • edited March 2012

    It's called cloning, you simply clone the song and set it up differently, so for example say you have Halleluliah What a Saviour, and you want versus 1,2 then later 4,5 you create the song with all the verses, then use the clone feature, then call one of them say Halleluliah What a Saviour <45>, you set the first copy up using the verse order feature for V1 V2 then set up Halleluliah What a Saviour <45> with the verse order V4 V5 all of the other verses will be there, just hidden. Add both of them to your service in the appropriate spot.After the service in question, simply delete Halleluliah What a Saviour <45>and remove the verse order from the main one.

    Works really nicely, and you can always keep both in case you want to do it again.




  • edited March 2012

    I'm trying to keep it as easy to manage as possible, I have "He Loves Us" in twice, because the youth do it as was written originally, (Sloppy Wet Kiss). ANd I have "How Great thou Art" as 3, because we use a different theme for each verse, ditto with "In Christ Alone" but only 2 times.   I don't like to clutter the database anymore than I need to.  Which reminds me, I need to install a DB Viewer/Editor so I can run some custom reports. 

  • edited March 2012

    If you keep your copies in the right mode, you can remove them after the service.  You could try downloading the Sqlite ODBC driver and connect to your database, then use Office or LibreOffice to connect to it. 

     Update: I wrote my own report in Perl using the DBI:Sqlite driver, works nice and slick, took about 30 minutes.


  • edited March 2012

    Looks like it's working like I want it too, the One we do this most with is "Amazing Grace(My Chains Are Gone) some times we leave out the hymn, sometimes we leave out the chorus, sometimes we do the whole song, and at least once on another song, we introduced the chours of at the start and then did the song fully at offertory.  What threw me off is I saw the same Verse Order assignment on both instances, tho the actual service item was as I wanted it.   Just gotta make sure the song doesn't save back to the Database.   

    And on that front, if we have it so we can edit in the service, would it be possible to put a "Save to DB" option in there? I keep forgetting to make the changes to Database on new songs that I have to tweak durring practice. 

  • edited June 2012

    There are two ways to do this. The one that I use is... to create two instances of the song ie...

     "Amazed <Pasquale>"...."Amazed (V2) <Pasquale>" for the different methods of performance.

    The other when the lyrics are the same but have verses removed or in different order. have one instance of the song but in the comments save the dfferent performance methods ie....

    Pasquale C1 V1 V2 C2 V3 V4 C2 V5 C2

    Pasquale (V2) V1 C1 V2 C2 V3 V4 C2 V5 C2

    Conrad V1 C1 V2 C2 V3 C1 V4 C2 V5 C2

    So each time you use the song you just go to the comments and copy and paste the correct performance into the verse order and save it.

    The method for identifing this need is...

    "Amazed <pasquale>" (one performer/one method)

    "Blessed Be Your Name <Multiple>" (Multiple performers and or methods in comments section)

    I hope this helps, Thanks



  • Why do you have to clone the songs.  It should use the master song and overlay what verses to use in the Service Manager without changing the master song at all.

    We set our service up in advance then save it for use later. At a recent service the song leader did not follow the set verse order. We tried to send the master song in the Song tab of Media Manager live but it had the same verse order as the Service Manager so I had to blank the screen till he got to the correct verse. So I guess I could have cloned the song in advance but this was the first time it has happened and seems like a waste to clone every song "just in case".

    If there is a setting to change this please let me know, I did not find one.

    Feedback please.
  • I have to agree with HBC. When you add a song to a service it is copied into the service file. If you edit the song in the service then it would make more sense to edit the local copy rather than the database.
  • I think one option would be to add to the Song options a

    Save Changes in the Service to Master.. 

    This would be the opposite option to save changes to master to service.  Which would essentially allow the editing of a song item in a service to be a virtual clone. 
  • Yeah, an option to save the service copy back to Master would be great, because often times, it's quicker/easier to fix a problem in the service instance than going to the song database and finding it and editing it.  SO an option to "Save Changes to Database" would be great.
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